Defensive Scoring tweak

[braven112]

I wanted to run this by everyone, in my other league we are talking about changing the defensive scoring regarding points allowed and moving to a sliding scale much like we do for kickers and yardage for Position players. Since we have the same scoring I wanted to bring it up here as well. It would go like this:

0-999 points allowed = 15 points
1- 35 points allowed = -0.6 points per point allowed
(this results in -6 at 35 points allowed)
36-999 points allowed = -0.01 points per point allowed

Just to show you the extreme example:
-6.38 73 Points Allowed (This is the NFL record for most points scored in a game and since we use offensive points against the actual number of offensive points allowed in this game was probably even less)

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What%20is%20t ... all%20team

This would move away from the tiers that we currently use and each point allowed would result in your team scoring less points as opposed to the current system where some points matter more and others don't count against you at all since you may not drop to the next tier.

This is what we currently have:

Offensive Points Against 0-0 15
Offensive Points Against 1-6 10
Offensive Points Against 7-13 6
Offensive Points Against 14-20 1
Offensive Points Against 21-27 0
Offensive Points Against 28-34 -2
Offensive Points Against 35-999 -6

[Achon44]

Awesome!

[bonscott]

I'm not opposed to it but when I ran some test number this will increase the defensive scoring by a bit, 3-4 pts in some cases. Just wanted to point that out.

[braven112]

I'm not opposed to it but when I ran some test number this will increase the defensive scoring by a bit, 3-4 pts in some cases. Just wanted to point that out.

Here is another idea, same basic concept but utilizing the current tiers as a milestons if you will:

15.00 0 Points Allowed
14.17
13.33
12.50 3 Points Allowed
11.67
10.83
10.00 6 Points Allowed
9.43
8.86
8.29
7.72 10 Points Allowed
7.15
6.58
6.00
5.29
4.57 15 Points Allowed
3.86
3.14
2.43
1.71
1.00 20 Points Allowed
0.63
0.25
-0.13
-0.50
-0.88 25 Points Allowed
-1.25
-1.63
-2.00
-2.57
-3.14 30 Points Allowed
-3.71
-4.29
-4.86
-5.43
-6.00 35 Points Allowed
-6.01 36 Points Allowed (-0.01 for every point allowed after this)

[bonscott]

I think it's simpler the way you first posted it. I don't have a problem awarding more points to the Def, I was just pointing it out. In fact in my league the Def scores quite a bit more because we award points for certain levels of rush or passing yards against, number of first downs given up, return yards and so forth.

Anyway, go with your first proposal.

[joe.commish]

I'd be fine with the first proposal.

[braven112]

I was going to post our defensive scoring rules as an idea in another league and realized that we never voted on this. I used this scoring setup in my other league last year and I really liked that every point counted.

[bonscott]

Wow, talk about zombie thread!

Here are the defensive scoring that I've used in my league for over 10 years, works well, is balanced not only within the position but also the offense. Of course this year we finally dumped team defense and went with IDP's (which is much better IMO). Offensive scoring is pretty much the same as this league other then we give full PPR to all positions.

Code: Select all

Special Teams Points Against plus Offensive Points Against	0-0	10	Edit	
Special Teams Points Against plus Offensive Points Against	1-9	6	Edit	
Special Teams Points Against plus Offensive Points Against	10-19	3	Edit	
Special Teams Points Against plus Offensive Points Against	20-29	0	Edit	
Special Teams Points Against plus Offensive Points Against	30-39	-3	Edit	
Special Teams Points Against plus Offensive Points Against	40-49	-6	Edit	
Special Teams Points Against plus Offensive Points Against	50-99	-10	Edit	
Kickoff Return Yards plus Punt Return Yards	100-999	1.00 points for 100, and then 1 point for every 25 thereafter	Edit	
Fumble Recoveries (from Opponent)	1-99	1.00 point each	Edit	Test
Interceptions Caught	1-99	1.00 point each	Edit	Test
Blocked Field Goals	1-99	3.00 points each	Edit	Test
Blocked Punts	1-99	2.00 points each	Edit	Test
Blocked Extra Points	1-99	1.00 point each	Edit	Test
Sacked a QB	1.0-20.0	1.00 point each	Edit	Test (Warning!)
Safeties	1-99	2.00 points each	Edit	Test
Total Net Yards Passing Allowed	0-50	4.00	Edit	Test
Total Net Yards Passing Allowed	51-100	3.00	Edit	Test
Total Net Yards Passing Allowed	101-150	2.00	Edit	Test
Total Net Yards Passing Allowed	151-200	1.00	Edit	Test
Total Net Yards Passing Allowed	201-999	0.00	Edit	Test
Total Net Yards Rushing Allowed	0-25	6.00	Edit	Test
Total Net Yards Rushing Allowed	26-50	4.00	Edit	Test
Total Net Yards Rushing Allowed	51-75	2.00	Edit	Test
Total Net Yards Rushing Allowed	76-999	0.00	Edit	Test
Opponent Successful 2 Point Conversions	1-99	-1.00 point each	Edit	
Opponent Failed 2 Point Conversions	1-99	1.00 point each	Edit	
Number of Defensive & Special Teams TDs	0-10	6 points each	Edit	Test
Opponent First Downs	0-5	4	Edit	
Opponent First Downs	6-10	3	Edit	
Opponent First Downs	11-15	2	Edit	
Opponent First Downs	16-20	1	Edit	
Opponent First Downs	21-99	0	Edit	

[braven112]

Biggest thing I was hoping to do was move away from tiers and make every point count.

[bonscott]

I'm fine with it as I was before. Put it up for vote and see what the masses think.

[braven112]

Here is what the scoring would look like under the 3 proposals. I like that every point counts but it does increase the scoring for the top defenses as you mentioned. I like the simplicity of the original proposal but its a much bigger change than the alternate. The alternate version lowers the scoring a bit for the bad teams and increases the top teams scoring. I would lean towards the second proposal personally because its less of a change to the overall balance that we have now.

Our Current Rules
http://football13.myfantasyleague.com/2 ... ints&TEAM=*

First Proposal
http://football13.myfantasyleague.com/2 ... ints&TEAM=*

Alternate Proposal
http://football11.myfantasyleague.com/2 ... ints&TEAM=*

[griblets]

I've never liked defensive team scoring. I especially have never like combining it with special teams. My league used to "tweak" the defensive scoring system every season. Several years ago, I decided to create a scoring system that would measure the things that good defenses do. Since the change, we have never had another tweak. First, we removed, special teams scoring and award players only with return TD's. Below is how we've scored the defenses...

Opponent Punts 1 point each
Number of Defensive Fumble Recovery TDs 6 points each
Fumble Recoveries (from Opponent) 2 points each
Number of Interception Return TDs 6 points each
Interceptions Caught 2 points each
Sacked a QB 1 point each
Safeties 2 points each
Total Net Yards Allowed -.01 point for every 1 allowed
Number of Offensive TDs Allowed -1 point for every 1
Opponent Fourth Downs Failed 1 point

The thought process:
Punts and 4th Downs Failed: Good defenses can force teams to punt even if they don't force turnovers. They should be rewarded for such.
Yards Allowed: Same thought as Brandon's - incremental tiers aren't good enough, especially when measuring every yard that a skill position gains.
TD's allowed: The main goal of the defense is to keep the offense out of the end zone. Penalize the equivalent of 100 yards against for failing. (FG's might put points on the board, but aren't really a defense failing).

The rest is fairly normal. It creates a nice point differential between good and bad defenses, which makes the position somewhat relevant. I don't know how something like this would fit with the offensive point system in this league, but I couldn't be happier with this concept.

Here is how our scoring looked last season - http://football8.myfantasyleague.com/20 ... nts&TEAM=*.

Like, dislike, use it, or don't, I don't care. But it's out there for discussion if anybody finds it interesting.

[bonscott]

Here is what the scoring would look like under the 3 proposals. I like that every point counts but it does increase the scoring for the top defenses as you mentioned. I like the simplicity of the original proposal but its a much bigger change than the alternate. The alternate version lowers the scoring a bit for the bad teams and increases the top teams scoring. I would lean towards the second proposal personally because its less of a change to the overall balance that we have now.

Our Current Rules
http://football13.myfantasyleague.com/2 ... ints&TEAM=*

First Proposal
http://football13.myfantasyleague.com/2 ... ints&TEAM=*

Alternate Proposal
http://football11.myfantasyleague.com/2 ... ints&TEAM=*

I don't really have a preference either way. Pick one and vote. No matter what you pick I'm sure you won't get 100% so if passed it won't be until 2013 anyway.

[bonesman]

Is there a defensive scoring format that only accounts for the points a DST actually lets up when they're on the field?

So if you had New England DST and Brady throws a pick-6 and gets sacked in his own endzone, NE DST would only be charged with the XP despite 9 points being up on the scoreboard.

Or do we already have that going and that's why it says "Offensive Points Against" instead of just Points Against?

[braven112]

like, dislike, use it, or don't, I don't care. But it's out there for discussion if anybody finds it interesting.

There are some cool elements of it I like for sure, I like that you give credit for forcing punts, I think turnover on downs would be nice to give points to. At the end of the day I'd like the best teams to be around the 200-220 range and the bottom teams to 60-80 range. I might play around with some different scoring options and I'll post something later this season. We probalby aren't going to get anything done for this season so we're not in a hurry. I'd rather come up with something that will last rather than rush it.

If anyone has any other ideas post 'em, I'll put this up for vote in mid-August when we have more consistent eyeballs on the site for the cut-down date.

Or do we already have that going and that's why it says "Offensive Points Against" instead of just Points Against?

Yeah that is how we are doing it.